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Diastatic vs. Non-Diastatic Barley

Battling the MSG Myth » Sharing Ideas, Suggestions, and Information » Diastatic vs. Non-Diastatic Barley « Previous Next »

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Unregistered guest
Posted on Sunday, May 12, 2013 - 7:42 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've been trying to understand more about my son's particular reactions and give the Dr.'s more info as well.
I recently had an exchange of information from a man who is very well known in the bread making world.

Now my son has had (we believe) a reaction to Malted Barley (and it is listed as an avoid). I was told by a baker that Barley is typically added at the mill to wheat for flour, and this is Diastatic. When it is added at the bakery it is Non-Daistatic.
Here is the bread expert reply (part of it- and he was very informative as he could be);
"Flour naturally has a very limited source of simple sugars for the yeast. In order to sustain fermentation, especially in long fermented artisan breads, we rely on the activity of enzymes to break down more complex carbohydrates in the flour into simpler forms that can be used by the yeast. Typically when wheat comes out of the field, the enzyme activity is lower than we like for fermented breads, and that number is amended by the addition of one of two ingredients typically.

One is malted barley flour and the other is fungal amylase.

The barley flour is diastatic, meaning the enzymes are active vs. non-diastatic in which they are no longer active. Many bakeries add additional diastatic malt in the bakery to supplement the addition by the mill. I do not know enough to tell you how much is added in the mill but if a bakery were to be using malted barley for their baguettes for example they would typically be using as little as 8 oz for 100 pounds of flour. And for a typical artisan baguette, 100 lbs of flour would make about 170 pounds of dough, resulting in roughly as many baguettes depending on the size.

Most mills are using malted barley flour but some use another ingredient that serves the same purpose called fungal amylase. Fungal amylase needs to be used more carefully than malted barley flour because of its strength and therefore would never be used in a bakery, or at least not to my knowledge, only in the mill. The reason I called Udi's is because I think there may be a chance that the mill they buy flour from uses fungal amylase instead of malted barley, and also to ask if their flour is enriched. I will let you know if I get an answer.

In the bread making process there are two main types of enzyme groups naturally active amongst many others. One is amylase activity in which starches are being broken down into sugars and the other is protease activity in which the protein is being degraded. Malted barley flour and fungal amylase are used to increase amylase activity."

I was also informed through this communication that the breads my son eats regularly (as in at least twice a day) are in fact enriched- though not listed as such. He does not have a normal reaction to this bread.

so my thinking is there is a real difference between the Diastatic and Non-Diastatic Barley and will some of us react to all Barely or just the non-diastatic added at the bakery (for sweetness said the baker).

Deb A.
Unregistered guest
Posted on Monday, May 13, 2013 - 11:10 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Found a white flour that is unbromated and contains no malted barley flour or added enzymes...Bob's Red Mill. I try to avoid all forms of's naturally high in glutamate. The form added to flour throws me off. The enzyme in sprouted barley flour breaks some of the wheat protein down into sugar so that the yeast will grow better. I add sugar to my dough instead...and a pinch of pure vitamin C crystals..both of which feed the yeast quite well. Since wheat is naturally high in glutamate, I go very easy on bread. 3 times a week, maybe. Lately, have begun to make lettuce wraps instead. Know how kids love bread, though.
Deb A.
Unregistered guest
Posted on Monday, May 13, 2013 - 11:11 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have a glutamate sensitive friend who makes waffles from rice and wheat flour and freezes them for use later. She makes her sandwiches from them instead of yeast bread!
Unregistered guest
Posted on Monday, May 13, 2013 - 12:40 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

does that flour have added b-vitamins and iron?
Unregistered guest
Posted on Monday, May 13, 2013 - 7:01 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

it seems, according to the communication (I did not get the information directly from the source) the bread my son eats, Udi's Sourdough, is an enriched wheat- where the vitamins are added.

I once posted about enriched wheat and was called on the rug. But I soon found out that the Folic acid is bound (artificially) to Glutamic acid to be stable for use in products. This bind is easily broken in the gut . .and we know the rest.

But why does my son do ok. But it is possible that his normal now is so much better than it used to be that he is still reacting and I can't see it!

more mysteries, less answers!!! augh
Unregistered guest
Posted on Tuesday, May 14, 2013 - 7:44 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think (didn't look it up) white flour has to be enriched with added vitamins and iron. I have been looking for white flour that isn't.

I want to avoid both added iron and folic acid (not for glutamate reasons).
Unregistered guest
Posted on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 8:12 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sara, Bob's Red Mill Organic White Flour isn't enriched as far as I can tell. The non-organic, which looks almost identical, has malted barley and is enriched.
Unregistered guest
Posted on Wednesday, May 15, 2013 - 8:30 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

thanks - I had thought their white flour wasn't enriched but saw it at our store and it was so I didn't buy it -

I needed to find organic not the "other".

Now to find it - I imagine I can get it online.

I had hoped Stone-Buhr wasn't enriched but it was as I knew I could find it locally. I was actually surprised to find Bob's here at our IGA as they have a limited selection and I knew they had Stone Buhn. I knew they had other Bob's products though but I guess they didn't have the one I needed - ORGANIC.

even the iron content indicates it isn't enriched. YEAH
Unregistered guest
Posted on Monday, May 20, 2013 - 8:04 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah, it just baffles me that they make the labels so similar.

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