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Almonds & Poly Propylene Oxide (PPO)...

Battling the MSG Myth » Sharing Ideas, Suggestions, and Information » Almonds & Poly Propylene Oxide (PPO) « Previous Next »

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Melinda
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Posted on Wednesday, October 08, 2008 - 7:33 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wasn't sure where to put this topic, but wanted to share some info I received about Almonds. I have been eating almonds for years and never have had any adverse reactions until just recently. I am not entirely sure it is the almonds, but am suspect due to timing of ingestion and the reaction I am experiencing.

The brand I get is from a distributor in Washington State called NW Naturals and so I emailed them to see if they changed growers or their current grower changed their growing and production methods. I let them know I suspected reactions from their almonds.

Here is their response:
"I spoke with our processor about the possibility of any chemicals that could come into contact with our almonds. He stated that nine months ago the Federal Government required us to start pasteurizing all almonds grown and sold in the U.S. One of the processes allowed for this is the use of Poly Propylene Oxide (PPO). This is the method we use to meet government regulations".

Because they started pasteurizing their almonds using PPO nine months ago, I am either now reacting to this chemical or the reaction I am having is from something else, but again I wanted to share this info for anyone who may be interested. The use of PPO is most likely on ALL almonds since this is a Federal Regulation. Although I am not sure if the method of pasteurization always uses PPO, but it does in the case of my almonds and therefore may be others as well.

Almonds that are safe would be imported from other countries who do not require pasteurization so always ask the company where they get them from. I think my local health food coop gets theirs from outside the US since they label them as not having been sprayed, although they could be from US and therefore pasteurized but not sprayed....worth asking them. Almonds are one of my staples!
Dianne
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Posted on Thursday, October 09, 2008 - 12:52 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I wonder if other types of nuts go through the same pasteurizing process. I eat quite a bit of nuts, just not almonds. Scary, all the chemicals that are put into our food supply and don't even know it...and no one has to tell us. Thanks for the info Melinda
jjmartin
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Posted on Saturday, October 11, 2008 - 4:42 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm wondering if this could be true of organic dried figs, organic coconut, flax seeds, and bagged coleslaw, all of which I react to but could never figure out why? I know I react to all petro chemicals and PPO surely is a petro chemical. I read several articles and it can be used as racing fuel. One article questioned the reasoning that it is not safe to inhale but safe to ingest!!!!
Dianne
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Posted on Saturday, October 11, 2008 - 1:23 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

jjmartin, I wonder if you were to contact any of those producers, would they tell you the truth like the response Melinda got. I think I'll try writting a few letters and see what kind of answers I get....I'll let you all know.
jjmartin
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Posted on Sunday, October 12, 2008 - 3:16 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have some phone numbers written down to contact on Monday. My brother-in-law retired from the dairy industry and used to have people ask for "written assurance" concerning product ingredients and procedures.
Melinda
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Posted on Monday, October 13, 2008 - 9:37 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting about the organic coconut and flax seeds jj - What type of coconut and what brand do you react to? The shredded stuff or do you react to the oil or butter too?

I use flax seeds in a "safe" muffin recipe I created, yet pretty much daily I find myself having mild to moderate reactions and I have yet to figure out what it is. I love coconut but don't incorporate it into my daily diet so not sure about that one if I react, but would like to start using it on regular basis.

The almonds I was eating were not organic and I just bought some organic ones along with organic pecans. I am not eating nuts for 3-4 days to see if a reaction I've been having subsides and then will try to eat them again (the organic ones) and see if I notice anything.

Keep us all posted on any information any of you get from writing or calling these companies :-)
Deb A.
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Posted on Monday, October 13, 2008 - 9:48 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Flax seeds are high in naturally occurring glutamate, or so I have read here some time ago.
Dianne
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Posted on Monday, October 13, 2008 - 12:49 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Melinda, I would be interested in hearing if the organic almonds provoke a reaction. And I wonder if ALL almonds grown elsewhere need to be sterilized the same as in CA. I found this:

"Cornucopia Group, others protest plan to require all CA almonds to be sterilized
06 Apr 07 - CORNUCOPIA, Wis. -- Small-scale farmers, retailers and consumers are outraged over a new federal regulation that will require all almonds grown in California to be sterilized with various "pasteurization" techniques.

The most common method of sterilizing almonds is by propylene oxide fumigation. Propylene oxide is a genotoxic chemical and is listed as a possible carcinogen by the International Agency on Cancer Research and has been banned for treating food for human consumption in the European Union, Canada, Mexico, and most other countries."

http://www.localharvest.org/forum/thread.jsp?forum=16&thread=400
jjmartin
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Posted on Monday, October 13, 2008 - 1:11 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I had trouble with Jennies Coconut Macaroons but I know others have said they can eat them. I called them some time ago and they swear there is nothing on the coconut. As for the figs just talked to a lady and she swears the same--nothing is on them. I mentioned the almonds being treated without disclosure and although she is located in California and in the organic food industry she knew nothing of it! Haven't called any flax producers but may yet. It is natural to want to know what could be causing a reaction, but it is important to just trust our bodies to tell us!
Melinda
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Posted on Tuesday, October 14, 2008 - 8:22 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"Flax seeds are high in naturally occurring glutamate, or so I have read here some time ago".

Deb, Yikes, I had not heard of that, thanks for the info...will be tossing my flax seeds immediately! The amount I ingest seems minimal, but may be adding to my symptoms and I have no problems omitting them from my diet.

"Propylene oxide is a genotoxic chemical and is listed as a possible carcinogen by the International Agency on Cancer Research and has been banned for treating food for human consumption in the European Union, Canada, Mexico, and most other countries."

Thanks for adding that info Diane. This is an outrage in my opinion as I am sure all here will concur. I am perplexed beyond comprehension why so many things are approved or ok to put in food regardless of the truth of what the substance really is and the possibility or even probability of being toxic. I know I am preaching to the choir here, but just can't understand it.

Almonds, like I said, are one of my staples - my diet is so limited as it is. I have not tried the organic ones yet - still having some reactions and it's been several days of not eating them so something else in my diet may either be the problem or there are several things and I am having a hard time figuring this one out. I'll keep y'all posted when I start to eat the organic almonds as to any reactions or not.
Dianne
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Posted on Wednesday, October 15, 2008 - 5:30 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Melinda,

Sometimes my symptoms will remain for several days after injesting something "not safe". So perhaps some of your reactions may still be from the almonds... I don't know???
Deb A.
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Posted on Wednesday, October 15, 2008 - 9:16 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Several people have said that they are beginning to react to bananas. Anyone here having problems? My daughter said she began reacting to the ones she was using in smoothies, and now does fine with organic ones. Someone called recently saying that they began reacting to the generic store brand of Ibuprofen...be careful of ingredients and where they came from.
Melinda
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Posted on Thursday, October 16, 2008 - 2:40 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Since I've been trying to locate the source of my recent reactions, I have noticed past two days after eating eggs I immediately get the face flush thing and a bit of head squeezing and fog. I've been eating eggs forever and never noticed this immediate reaction until recently. I eat 2 eggs daily. The kind I've been buying is Organic Valley Omega-3. I looked at the carton today and saw written on there that the chickens are fed a diet high in flax seeds. I am wondering if this is the reason...the flax in their diets? Hmmmm, interesting. I am going to switch to a different type of egg and see if that doesn't help. Anyone else react to eggs I wonder?
Melinda
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Posted on Thursday, October 16, 2008 - 2:44 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dianne, yes...for sure I am taking into consideration that the msg is now built up in my system and so it seems i am more sensitive to everything. For example, I wouldn't normally react to the eggs, but since my "msg pot" has overflowed, I am now reacting to them and the original source could very well have been the almonds.

Thanks for the tips everyone!

I just roasted the organic almonds and will be eating them in a bit here so we'll see how I do with that.
Judith
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Posted on Friday, October 17, 2008 - 11:33 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just to add to the confusion about flax seeds and eggs, and which came first, the chicken or the egg - I eat flax seeds and don't have reactions to them. I also count myself among the extremely sensitive on this list. However, my flax seed is from Canada, and that might make a difference. I would think organic flax should be fine for everyone assuming nothing suspect is leaching onto the fields where flax is being grown. As for eggs, I often have problems and the more omega in them, the more problems I have. Usually chickens are fed flax to increase omegas, so I can't explain that, unless the flax is from the U.S. and that is the problem. The eggs I eat are advertised as "free run" but aren't organic and don't mention omegas on the carton. I do fine with them. And they are running free in a barn, so they're still being fed something pre-made. Flax is very good for you but no one should eat more than 2 ground TBSP a day. It also makes a fine egg replacer. If anyone is interested to know how, I can post that. Oh and it's perishible, so make sure you keep it refrigerated and not for more than a few months.
James D.
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Posted on Friday, October 17, 2008 - 4:09 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When we first learn that excitoxins are a problem for us the cumulative effect that it has had on us is often so profound and so strong that even lowering the dose a little may at first seem like a cure. But later on as we purify and pay more attention to how we feel and how certain foods affect us, we may learn more about subtle effects that we never noticed before. During this phase it may seem like we are becoming more sensitive, but I wonder if it is due to becoming more aware?
Melinda
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Posted on Saturday, October 18, 2008 - 3:53 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Judith, I've eaten the Omega-3 eggs before and didn't think I reacted but now am, so it's interesting to hear you too react to the Omega ones. Could be the flax (US variety) in their diets and/or something else - maybe they are fed soy and quite possibly corn too. I just bought Wilcox Organic Free Range eggs and had two this morning but still have mild reactions - may or may not be connected to the eggs. It's so hard to tell when you've got so much msg in your system to begin with. But I also drank coffee - a local organic brand - and now am making a coffee connection to my reactions too.

James, interesting points you made there. Quote: "During this phase it may seem like we are becoming more sensitive, but I wonder if it is due to becoming more aware". Could be a little of both.
Deb A.
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Posted on Monday, October 20, 2008 - 10:59 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Good points, James...well said. I have noticed that I do well with the Eggland eggs. They cost more, but the flavor reminds me of the eggs we ate as kids.
sara
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Posted on Wednesday, January 18, 2012 - 8:02 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Post above from jjmartin dated Monday, October 13, 2008

"I had trouble with Jennies Coconut Macaroons but I know others have said they can eat them. I called them some time ago and they swear there is nothing on the coconut."

Can any one tell me about their experience with these? The recipe has changed recently it appears - decreased honey and added cane juice.

I am reacting to something - think it might be these cookies.


here is a link for the ones I have - I got them because they are low oxalate but I am getting more MSG type reactions I think (raised BP, palpitations included).

http://macaroonking.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=1&products_id=10



thanks in advance for any insight
Di
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Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2012 - 4:04 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

sara, can you tolerate each ingredient separately? If so, could you make the cookies yourself?

Ingredients: Sulfite Free Coconut, Organic Evaporated Cane Juice with Honey, Egg Whites.
sara
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Posted on Thursday, January 19, 2012 - 9:04 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I don't know about the coconut - it wasn't a problem in the past but not so sure now.

I figured I would try these before embarking on making them myself. I rarely bake things and rarely have the big oven on - I cook in a counter oven for the most part.
Deb A.
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Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 11:06 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I notice that I do okay with bulk toasted almonds from the grocery store but not as well with others that are raw and whole. I suspect that most raw, whole ones are being fumigated with PPO..propylene oxide, and since the others are toasted already, they meet the Federal requirements for pasteurization. I rinsed off a handful of the salted Costco mixed nuts, and still felt funny afterwards. I don't think it's easy to rinse off the hydrolyzed vegetable gums they use to adhere the salt to the nut..plus, they may have been sprayed. UGH!..so frustrating.
Anyone have any brands they have found to be safe?
Hoteru
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Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2012 - 4:12 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Deb,
California supplies 80% of all the almonds grown in the world. Now all commercially sold almonds have to be sprayed with something, not sure whether it is PPO, before being sold EXCEPT growers selling their own produce at farmers' markets can continue to preserve them only by putting them in cold storage. I buy them now from a particular grower at one of the many local farmers' markets and can eat only this kind safely.
I didn't eat any commercial almonds for quite a while as I couldn't figure out why the same brand would be okay one week and make me sick the next. This was during the time the law changed and I was getting some old almonds (non-sprayed) and some new almonds (sprayed under the new laws) as companies were permitted to use up their stocks.
Deb A.
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Posted on Monday, January 23, 2012 - 12:35 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Hoteru! Good to hear from you...but sad to hear about all our almonds. What about organic almonds?
Hoteru
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Posted on Wednesday, January 25, 2012 - 3:09 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Deb,
I sent an email yesterday to the California Almond Board asking them to verify the legal requirements for selling almonds.
I will let you know what I hear back.
My current understanding is all almonds commercially sold other than at farmers' markets have to be sprayed so organic would be sprayed as well.
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 3:30 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hoteru, maybe this will help:

http://www.cornucopia.org/almond/Almond_Fact_Sheet.pdf
LisaS
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Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 8:04 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sara, could it be possible the egg whites are extracted with high heat or altered some way? Most of the protein is in the white so if they are processing this like a protein it's *possible* it has FGA, though I've never heard of egg whites being an issue. It's just on my mind, because I recently had something where I missed "wheat gluten" on the label (sprouted grain bread! So much for being just sprouted grains and no "flour"!)
Deb A.
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Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 10:24 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've wondered about dried egg whites, too, Lisa. So far, if I only use 2 T. per drink, I have done okay. But, you are right about the high drying heat some producers use. I do prefer the liquid pasteurized egg whites by Crystal Farms (Walmart and grocery stores). I called them once, and I asked how they could pasteurize them without cooking them. I was told it was their secret method.
Deb A.
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Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 10:25 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hoteru, thanks for doing the research for us concerning almonds. Look forward to hearing what they say.
LisaS
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Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2012 - 12:44 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Deb, I've heard of high pressure pasteurization for other things but the eggs are probably just barely heated for a short time. http://askville.amazon.com/pasteurize-eggs-cooking/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=5137780
Hoteru
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Posted on Saturday, January 28, 2012 - 4:24 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Deb and Roy,
Haven't heard anything from the Almond Board yet, will ping them again next week if I don't hear anything.
The information on Roy's link is great, thanks again Roy, you always come through with great information!
I'm still checking in regularly, just don't have much to say.
Mariann
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Posted on Friday, February 03, 2012 - 8:49 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am doing fine with organic raw almonds, but I did have trouble with bananas a while back. I was getting organic because they did not have Chiquita the one I used because it was mentioned on this site some time ago as OK. The organic ones were by Del Monte, I always avoid Dole. The Organic ones from Del Monte were my problem. I found Chiquita again and I am doing fine once more. Mariann
Deb A.
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Posted on Friday, February 03, 2012 - 11:02 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are the Chiquita ones organic, too? I am going to hunt for that brand...always preferred them, but now all I find is Dole organic.
sara
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Posted on Friday, February 03, 2012 - 5:00 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Chiquita is available organic - our Safeway normally has both but on Wed most of the unorganic was Dole.
Mariann
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Posted on Friday, February 03, 2012 - 6:34 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I can't find Chicquita all the time, but I notice that one of the local markets has them more than the bigger super markets. I put them in the freezer and can keep them quite a while. I buy them when I can get them. The ones I get are not organic but they don't bother me and I am quite sensitive. After the freezer you defrost them but not totally, you can use the bananas for making muffines, or breads, probably good in smoothies too since they get pretty soft but the color remains good. The skins get all dark brown so it looks like they are not good but they are fine. I noticed if I defrost them completely they are very soft and mushy and you need to cut the end off and sort of squeeze the banana out like toothpaste. Very creamy and nice to bake with though. I have a recipe for a very high fiber muffin that I love and have shared with many friends. They love them too. I used a recipe on the package of high fiber cereal and just added my own touches to it. I love them and they are a great alternative to the high protein bars that people tend to use that are pricey and full of bad things. I make a doz. or more at a time and freeze them. They are ready to just grab and go if I am out doing a lot of errands or going to have tea with a friend. When I do that. I ask for a cup of hot water and bring my own organic tea bags. I never trust that they will have what I need. It leads to going out on a limb and trying things that might make me sick. Don't do that anymore. Mariann
Hoteru
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Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2012 - 3:05 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yesterday I sent the Almond Board a second email asking again about the processing of almonds. We'll see whether they answer this time.
Deb A.
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Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2012 - 8:51 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Mariann! We need your banana high fiber muffin recipe! Sounds so good. We need to add a recipe topic to post under, don't we.
Hoteru
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Posted on Thursday, February 16, 2012 - 3:58 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

All,
No answer from the California Almond Board after two tries. May send one last polite message. Roy's summary was excellant, probably no better information would be forthcoming from the Almond Board if they did answer.
A bit off topic, I emailed Trader Joe's yesterday to see whether any of their ground beef, which I have been using as a staple, is processed with amonia, comes from Beef Products, Inc. and what is the source of their ground beef.
Today I got a return email saying they had received my message and will be responding.
Mariann
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Posted on Tuesday, February 21, 2012 - 5:14 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Deb, I am going over the posts that I have missed and saw your request for the muffin recipe. I have two. One is high fiber and the other is for a doctored up banana bread recipe from my daughter. I have them posted on my new blog site. My grand son set it up for me so my new msg free converts can get it. I taught the class on the 7th of Feb. and it was so awesome. Great reception, wonderful people. I am going to do a second one tonight and then a Phase II of the first one. I brought some muffins in for them to taste. I wanted them to see you can make your own fast food and take it with you. It tastes very good too. So you can go to nananewshome.blogspot.com. I am new at this so it is pretty sparse other than the recipes. It is long because I do a lot of explaining in it. I am trying to help people new to the whole concept of clean eating and label. So bear with me and I hope you love the muffins. Everyone I share them with does. Mariann
Deb A.
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 9:59 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wonderful...will check out your new blog after I post here. How did the second class go?
I hope more people will start their own MSG related blogs...even if they are mainly recipes...more people will see this as an important issue and become aware. Thank you so much for adding this support for others.
jjmartin
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Posted on Monday, April 09, 2012 - 6:22 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I haven't been on the board in a bit. I reacted to Jennie's coconut macaroons again and so searched board and found that I had written with the problem in October of 2008! I wondering if anyone has since in 3 plus years found out any thing more. Jennies has now been sold to Red Farms and is using cane juice instead of honey. The man I talked to this morning didn't sound very professional and swore the egg whites they use are not powdered....
sara
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Posted on Monday, April 09, 2012 - 1:37 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

these 2 recipes were posted last night on the avoiding corn board for coconut macaroons - I am thinking of trying the maple one first

http://blog.williams-sonoma.com/cookie-of-the-day-maple-macaroons/

http://www.elanaspantry.com/paleo-coconut-macaroons/

I think I reacted to the Jennies' coconut macaroons with a "die off" type reaction - I had eaten way too many over a short few days - I have since bought just one can at a time so there is only one can in the house and don't have this same problem.

And yes the recipe had changed but I never had them with the old recipe. Perhaps one of these two above recipes will satisfy my needs / wants.
Jjmartin
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Posted on Monday, April 09, 2012 - 3:43 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Actually I spent alot of time today googling and have learned that all coconut that is sold as shredded for bakery goods is dried and subjected to heat and I think that is the problem for me.
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Tuesday, April 10, 2012 - 2:44 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The trees in my yard have more coconuts than I would know what to do with.
jjmartin
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Posted on Wednesday, April 11, 2012 - 3:34 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Where do you live? Seems that most of the coconuts I read about were from the Phillipines. Do you know how coconuts are processed?
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Wednesday, April 11, 2012 - 7:50 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

South Florida, but coconut trees grow in tropical coastal areas evertwhere.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/Coconut_distribution.png

The link below details coconut processing:

http://ecoport.org/ep?SearchType=earticleView&earticleId=127&page=1417
jjmartin
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Posted on Friday, April 13, 2012 - 3:51 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

After yet more study I have found that coconut is often washed with chlorine and soaked in propylene glycol. This is kind of like lanolin is for me. I should be able to use lanolin but because of the chemicals used to "clean" it I can not....Same with coconut. I trust my body to let me know but seem intent on learning why...
LisaS
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Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2012 - 5:18 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You might try talking to the people at http://www.tropicaltraditions.com/ -- from my dealings with them, they seem like a good company and might have insights into coconut processing.
jjmartin
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Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2012 - 3:17 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks. I will try that.
bo'nana
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Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2012 - 9:00 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

this is a very interesting thread! i just commented elsewhere on my own sporadic reactions to coconut- sometimes its fine, sometimes i get a bad tum with cramping & urgency. ive never understood why... thank you for sharing what you have learned JJ... i am very sensitive to chlorine and propylene glycol does give me cramping.
now my next question would be: do the OG manufacturers use these chems also? my "gut" reaction would seem to indicate that at least some of them maybe do!
thanx so much for your posts on the subject!

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