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Battling the MSG Myth » Archive » Help! I Have a Question » Gelatin « Previous Next »

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Posted on Saturday, January 13, 2001 - 8:44 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Please tell me if unflavored gelatin can be dangerous. I have taken it for nails about one year and am now having chronic hives. Anyone out there informed??
Carol H
Posted on Saturday, January 13, 2001 - 9:18 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you can, avoid gelatin. You may be allergic to it. It is an extremely processed food.
Laurie M
Posted on Saturday, January 13, 2001 - 7:07 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Gelatin always contains MSG. I would stop eating it. I do miss Jello though.
Posted on Thursday, February 15, 2001 - 9:15 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi everybody, Im new to all this computer writing so please bear with me .Iam learning how to work a computer from the library computer. my question is Iam allergic to salicylates as well as a sensitivity to msg /sulfites.s0 where do I begin to figure out what to eat. I have adhd which makes me sensitive to alot of things in the environment . are there any toothpastes ,soaps, shampoos that dont have any msg, salicylates,aspartame and offending agents?THANKS
Gerry Bush
Posted on Tuesday, January 30, 2001 - 9:04 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anonymous, yes, I buy "Tom's" toothpaste, deodorant, etc. at Trader Joe's. Try any health food store and you should be able to find it. Good luck.
Posted on Wednesday, February 14, 2001 - 9:59 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

To Anonymous:

Try Seventh Generation Soaps, and look up I love the SG detergent and the SW bars of soap.
Carol H
Posted on Friday, February 16, 2001 - 2:34 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Soaps -
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Friday, February 16, 2001 - 2:53 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hello, everyone!!!
This is my first mesaage that I am posting. Yesterday, I received my membership form from NoMSG which I promptly mailed last night. For the last two months I have been following an MSG-free nutrition plan. (Never ate "MSG". At least that's what I thought.) Now, except with some unintentional setbacks I feel better than I have in my entire life!!! I thought that I might get a Medic Alert bracelet; then, I went on this site last night and found out I was not the first or only person with this condition who had this idea. My reactions have never been as severe as anaphylactic (Spelling?) shock. However, my reactions are becoming predictable and am afraid that now that I have found the answer to most of my life's problems, people may not think that they are severe enough to warrant a bracelet. Cannot decide...Help. Just called my doctor's office to ask whether it was necessary to come in for an actual diagnosis, they said (seemingly as uneducated as I once was)that if I have eliminated it then I know what goes into my body and that should be o.k. They thought that when I eat out or if in a car accident (God forbid) that people are supposed to tell us what's in the food. Oh, good grief...So now I'm not sure that I need a Medic Alert bracelet. (I'm also highly sensitive to chemicals and latex, too.) I would greatly appreciate any input. Thanks, much. Christine.
Gerry Bush
Posted on Friday, February 16, 2001 - 10:39 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Christine, you are not alone. Many of us who post on this site share your symptoms, concerns and questions. We try to help each other. Ask any and all questions that you feel a need to ask...and we will try to help/support you. Glad to have you with us.
Posted on Saturday, February 17, 2001 - 4:11 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there anything wrong with drinking Seltzer Water? Does it deplete calcium from the body?
I never drink soda/pop but use juices to make my own with seltzer water.
Deb A.
Posted on Sunday, February 18, 2001 - 9:05 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've read that carbonated water depletes calcium in the body and is the reason pregnant women are advised not to drink pop. However, if you are not drinking it like the average American soft drink junkie, you should be okay.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Monday, February 19, 2001 - 8:23 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I was wondering if anyone knows of any medical doctor (MD) in the San Diego area who is familiar with free-glutamate intolerance and supports patients with this condition? I MUST find someone for myself and my daughter very soon. PLEASE HELP...Thank you
Posted on Tuesday, February 20, 2001 - 10:21 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anyone ever had thoughts of suicide and Jekyl and Hyde (SP?) mood swings and anger reactions for something someone said that really was no cause for your response under normal circumstances--usually only those folks closest to you like a parent or significant other--(not necessarily expressed toward others out of social politeness...somehow able to control self) that has entirely diminished since stopping MSG?
Roy Piwovar
Posted on Tuesday, February 20, 2001 - 1:46 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)


I pasted the exchange below from another thread:
By Denise Robert on Saturday, January 27, 2001 - 10:16 pm:

Beware of Raman or Oriental Noodles. The main ingredient is msg. It caused me a night of anxiety and restlessness. The next morning I was in a rage. I think this dangerous substance should be taken off the market and out of the foods we eat.

By Roy Piwovar on Sunday, January 28, 2001 - 06:29 am:

The word is getting out. I copied & pasted this from a forum on the web:

"MSG and BiPolar Disorder
This response submitted by on 10/12/99.
Email Address:

My 16 year old son is diagnosed with Baby BiPolar Disorder and ADHD. He has an Impulsive Disorder as well. Today, after a behavior outburst and suspension from school the Doctor told him to eliminate all MSG from his diet for 2 weeks. I will try anything to make his and our lives clamer. I need a list of foods that contain MSG and any other suggestions of diet changes. Being 16, his current diet consists of hot dogs, pizza, bologna, frozen prepared foods, Ramen noodles, and micro-meals. Thanks!"
Judy T
Posted on Tuesday, February 20, 2001 - 2:27 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Before I eliminated msg I was able to control the rage/sadness response by retiring, by maintaining a separate household half of each week, and by putting every bit of energy into outwardly controlling the rage and doing lots of journaling and other self-help stuff. Now that I'm on whole foods only and no msg, the rage/sadness symptoms are gone. Suicide? Nah. I'm too ornery.
Carol H
Posted on Tuesday, February 20, 2001 - 3:23 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think it's very common, anonymous. During the time I was the most sensitive to MSG, I would go through depression/rage episodes, and often felt that living was just too hard. Those episodes are gone. A good friend of mine who drinks diet pepsi every day - I cannot get them to quit, now takes medication to deal with terrible depression.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, February 21, 2001 - 8:56 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I sincerely thank everyone who responded to my question of suicide/rage/depression question under the title Anonymous. My name is Christine. I wasn't yet ready to admit who I was living with such a dard side of my life to other people. Often I have had to deal with my parents responding to my question of what they would like for their birthdays with "I just want you to be in a good mood." As hard as I tried to invariably I would fail. It scares me to think that it has been something so seemingly simple. Of course my parents tried their darnest to provide me with the proper allergic care and control. However, had we known this, my life growing up may have been totally different. Within the past several years, I have tried going wheat-free, dairy-free, corn-free, gluten-free, and any of these various combinations with some relief, but something still haunted me. They have ridden this horrible rollercoaster with me for thirty years. I have not yet informed them of my latest venture since they are both ill (Mom has Crohn's or ulcerative colitis and I want them to concentrate on themselves). I may meet with opposition from them but I have to find a way that this time is it and it's right. Sometimes I fear that I'm just barking up the wrong tree again and I think it's silly, but I have to remind myself THIS IS IT--MSG and its offspring. I want to do more to alert others. I feel I'm only just beginning this journey to the other side. I'd love to start support groups within various areas. Please continue with your stories. They really help me. Should you prefer e-mail my address is Thank you all.
Posted on Saturday, March 10, 2001 - 6:27 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How can i figure out what foods are causing the brain fog cold chills and the hard time focusing on any given task , Iget theese symptoms continuously and it has not let up at all.since I have taken out as much msg sulfites,additives as much asI know of.I have been eating small amounts of safe foods that i know for certain . Iam puzzled as to what is the culprit . any ideas as to what i can try next,would be appreciated alot of my symptoms have gone away since eliminating msg ,additives and colorings so i know i am on the right track to living life more comfortably.i have been very hungry from not eating much but reluctant to eat more since i have been feeling so how do you find a balance way of living without becoming so neurotic . i have kept a food diary for a long time and need to know how can i tell what to write each day cause it feels exhausting .
Gerry Bush
Posted on Sunday, March 11, 2001 - 4:41 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anon- You are describing the symptoms that I got when I would use milk or milk products from cows that were fed food containing the bovine growth hormone rBST.
Since I discovered the cause, I now buy milk and dairy products only from Trader Joe's as they proudly proclaim that their milk and milk products are rBST free. No longer do I have those horrible symptoms you describe! Oh I do get nipped by msg occasionally, but the milk was a bigger problem...and I hated those chills. Good luck.
Posted on Sunday, March 11, 2001 - 6:19 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

make sure you don't smoke either, since they soak the leaves in msg to enhance the flavor.
Posted on Sunday, March 11, 2001 - 10:09 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

from anonymous to gerry bush i was thinking today that it might be the dairy cause Ive been eating alot of dairy lately ,and have had a hard time breaking free from it. iread from jack samuels site today also that in trying to see if you are sensitive to msg a person should cut out highly processed foods 1st.then add them back one at atime to see if there is any reactions or symptoms of msg sensitivity .well guesswhat foods he named to avoid ?butter bread and milk .my question to you is is it all dairy stuff that has that rgbt or just milk no trader joes here so is any other store sell with no rgst hormone thanks for the answer .oh yeah do youever get the symptoms i mentioned before or are they gone since you stopped dairyb with that hormone.and is organic dairy eliminate all those symptoms since i drink horizon milk and butter.ill wait for your reply.
Roy Piwovar
Posted on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 2:27 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

More on hormones in milk:
Posted on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 6:20 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What type of Horizon milk do you use? Is it ultrapasteurized? Is it low-fat?
What kind of butter do you use? (If you haven't done so already, you may want to use the keyword search and look up milk and butter. You can find the keyword search on the left under utilities. Allow it a few seconds to work after you input the word you are searching.)
Deb A.
Posted on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 7:07 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are you taking any vitamins? Avoiding nutrasweet? Most people, if they are MSG sensitive and are still reacting, are getting it from hidden sources, such as corn, dairy, commercial backed goods, and soy products.
Gerry Bush
Posted on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 7:45 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anonymous-Since I stopped the milk with rBSt growth hormone, no more symptoms as previously described. But you should beware of Horizon products. Their milk is Ultrapasteurized. Notice the abnormally long shelf life. This process creates LOTS of free glutamate.
Do what I and ask around. There must be some kind of store somewhere in your area that has organic products. But beware of Horizon.
Good luck and let me know how you make out.
Posted on Monday, March 12, 2001 - 8:18 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

hi roy anon. deb a, roy you never cease to amaze me with all those websites you post onthis site .where do you get them ?(ha!ha!)thanks for the site on hormones in milk.anon i use whole organic miilk from horizon also use horizon organic butter yes it says ultra pasteurized on the milk. what does that mean ? it also says homegnized . what does that mean ? i eat horizon organic butter. no the milk is not lowfat thanks for the idea on the key word never knew what the key word search was on this board meant .and didnt know how to use it .glad i know now . COOL! DEB A . I avoid nutrasweet like the plague! that s tuff sure is nasty . no i dont take vitamins .
deb a. thanks for this discussion board it is so neat to be able to communicate to people from all over the world.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Tuesday, March 13, 2001 - 8:29 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It's been awhile since I've posted anything here. Reason being...I went to visit an environment medical physician (an M.D. I was so excited to have found someone who I thought would understand) last Thursday, March 8th. My excitement waned when he wanted to test me for things like Candida, check my adrenal function, GI function, and this, that, and the other thing using saliva, urine, blood, and fecal tests. He also mentioned that I have a heart murmur that could be mitro valve prolapse (he qualified this by saying that he was not a cardiologist and that I should have an EKG.

Now, for many years, I've felt something like my heart would sustain a beat every once in awhile. Saturday, though I felt it quite a bit maybe around 7 times. Recently though I had gotten again addicted to corn chips--just corn, oil, sea salt, and lime. I've since stopped eating them (for now). I wonder too if that's why my daughter really hasn't been herself (remember I breastfeed her).

Anyways, now the doctor's office and I are going back and forth about this supplement that they want me to take to detox. It's called Ultra Clear or Ultra Clear Plus. I read the ingredients and the fourth one listed is...low and guessed it..."natural flavors" followed by an extensive list of other ingredients like antioxidants. They are trying to assure me that there is no MSG in it even after I gave them a list of suspected items. The manufacturer is assuring the doctor's office of this. They are checking on the L-glutamate or L-glutamine; I forget which it is. I think though that's o.k. from reading Deb's book that the "L" is fine but that the "D-glutamate" is not. So, needless to say I'm not convinced. But, maybe the amount would be so insignificant that the antioxidants and other detox stuff in it would "gloss over" so to speak any ill effects from the MSG or hidden source. They are saying that it's been tested on the most chemically sensitive and allergic people in the world. Any rash that I might get (if I did get one) would be from the supplement pulling toxins out. (SEE MORE BELOW after the Vitamin C info).

I did buy and only took for one day because of the taste some powdered vitamin C rather than the gelcap they tried to sell me. I truly don't know whether or not I'm sensitive to gelatin. It's label reads Vitamin C (ascorbic acid, corn-free), Calcium (carbonate), magnesium (carbonate), and potassium (bicarbonate). Other ingredients just says Silicon dioxide. The other reason that I stopped taking it is because I planned on going for allergy testing with this office for foods and chemicals (I'm very sensitive to any scents, fragrances, epoxy, paints, paint thinners, etc.); and since Vitamin C is a natural antihistamine, I decided to hold off.

Now the other thing that's got me worried about that detox Ultra Clear stuff is that the booklet has a diet in there which I don't think they expect me to follow since I'm nursing. In the booklet it even says that if pregnant or nursing not to do this diet because it hasn't been tested for that. Now, I'm REALLY questioning whether I should go through any kind of detox of even just using the powdered supplement without the full diet while I'm breastfeeding. I already eat fairly healthfully now--organic as much as possible, cutting out MSG, etc., preservs, artifical stuff. I'm trying desparately to remember by anatomy/physiology of what happens to toxins once released from the liver.

I would greatly appreciate any input anyone could give. Before I went to the doctor's office I was so adamant that MSG was the basis of so many of my problems. Then, after the appointment, I became very discouraged. Will my body detox on its own maybe just taking longer? How about fresh lemon juice and water? How much? Also, are most of you self-diagnosed? Please help. Thank you soo very much for listening. I truly do appreciate you all. Sincerely, Christine Swann
Roy Piwovar
Posted on Tuesday, March 13, 2001 - 9:14 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)


Per a prior post ( ), Dr. Blaylock says that taking supplements with glutamine is "risky".

Another post ( ) says that supplementation with Coenzyme Q10 is "beneficial" for people with mitral valve prolapse and other heart abnormalities.
Deb A.
Posted on Tuesday, March 13, 2001 - 9:23 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Christine, too much glutamic acid, whether it's free or bound, can cause problems if you are reactive to glutamate. The naturally bound form is broken down in the body into the free form eventually, and L-glutamic acid in supplements or preparations is usually highly processed and is most likely in the the free form already. L-glutamic acid is called L-glutamic acid whether it is free or bound. One will just enter the bloodstream faster than the other. D-glutamic acid is even more dangerous to us, because it's an even more altered, and less natural form of glutamic acid. I may have worded it poorly in the book. If it's glutamine, then according to Dr. Schwartz, it doesn't pose as much of a danger.If you have any fears at all, you should follow your instincts. You could at least postpone the detox until you are finished with breastfeeding. As many here will tell you, we have been on the doctor roller coaster ride ourselves, have submitted ourselves to different costly tests and treatments....often to no avail. But you have to decide what is best for you.
Deb S
Posted on Tuesday, March 13, 2001 - 11:10 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Christine -- Your instincts are good, listen to them. (As an aside, I react to all sorts of corn chips with just corn, oil and salt; even to homemade popcorn.)

Here are the ingredients in UltraClear:

Ingredients: Rice protein concentrate, rice syrup solids, magnesium citrate, dipotassium phosphate, calcium citrate, natural vanilla flavor, high oleic safflower oil, medium-chain triglycerides, vitamin C (Ester-C®), vitamin A (beta-carotene, palmitate), vitamin E (d-alpha tocopherol, d-alpha tocopheryl acetate), dicalcium phosphate, molybdenum amino acid chelate, zinc methionate, L-threonine, L-lysine hydrochloride, manganese gluconate, ferrous fumarate, L-glutathione, selenomethionine, copper gluconate, niacinamide, L-cysteine hydrochloride, N-acetylcysteine, pyridoxine hydrochloride, calcium pantothenate, riboflavin, thiamin hydrochloride, vitamin D3, chromium polynicotinate (ChromeMate® GTF), biotin, folic acid, potassium iodide, and cyanocobalamin.

There are enough suspicious ingredients that I wouldn't touch it--and I'm not breastfeeding an infant. The ones I'm concerned about are:

Rice protein concentrate
rice syrup solids
natural vanilla flavor
molybdenum amino acid chelate
L-cysteine hydrochloride

I don't know what a lot of the other things are, perhaps someone else can shed some light. Any protein concentrate or grain syrup solids are problematic, although rice is lower in natural glutamate than, say, corn or wheat. You don't know what amino acid the molybdenum is chelated to. And L-cysteine is one of the three main excitotoxins that Dr. Blaylock talks about.

Not all with MCS have the same degree of sensitivity to MSG and similar food additives that we do, so you may have to educate your Dr. in that regard. Trying to detox too quickly can be dangerous due to the release of stored toxins into your system. Better to take it slowly and just eliminate the bad things that caused the problems in the first place. I wouldn't doubt that toxins that are stored in fat would find an affinity for nice, rich breastmilk.
Deb A.
Posted on Tuesday, March 13, 2001 - 4:00 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When you see the word "citrate", it means that mineral or substance has been combined with citric acid, a corn derivative, in most instances.
There are other more natural methods to detox....freshly made vegetable juices are good, along with some fruit juices for several days. I heard of one method that is just fresh lemon juice, any natural sweetener, (but pure maple syrup is suggested), and cayenne pepper. You just drink that several times a day for several days. Someone here posted earlier about it, I think.
Roy Piwovar
Posted on Tuesday, March 13, 2001 - 4:21 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

detox formula posted by Kevin:

"THE FORMULA 2 Tbsp lemon or lime juice 2 Tbsp genuine maple syrup (grade C recommended) 1/10 Tsp cayenne pepper or to taste 10 oz hot water Combine the juice, maple syrup, and cayenne in a 10 oz glass and fill with medium hot water."
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 7:17 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dear Christine KPS-
Follow your gut!
-If you feel warning signs and red flags and the supplement that they are trying to sell you is expensive-take it as a red flag and say No Thanks.
"No Thanks" is a phrase that us MSG sensitive people must learn and use as a mantra-at parties, picnics, dinners, lunches, and any time someone offers us food or beverage. You do not owe people an explanation-the only time I offer one is when someone asks kindly (usually because they suspect MSG is harming them too).
From what you have said-my advice is to say "No Thanks". Search the internet for a cleansing diet. I was so bloated last week from msg that you would have thought I was on an eating binge for a month. My pants did not fit anymore and you could see the bloating under my shirt-I have a 31" waist that looked like a well fed 36" last week. My doctor prescribed furosemide( a strong diuretic)-I took 1/2 of one(which did the trick) and have been on Acidophilus(4 capsules which I empty into orange juice and throw away the gelatin capsule) for 3 days-I feel great and my mind has cleared. I felt listless and depressed and cloudy all last week. I had eaten out for lunch a few times and also Thai food on Friday. I knew it was Russian Roulette but I ate it anyway. I haven't been to the gym in 3 months (car problems all Winter) and I know this is not helping any. Aerobic exercise and moderate weight lifting is a great antidote and keeps your mind clear.
My main suggestion(which I promise to take myself as well) would be to go on a bland allergy type diet for 4-6 weeks with lots of fiber and water(pure filtered or bottled water like Poland Spring or Deer Park)-4 days a week minimum aerobic exercise (Reebok step (at home) is amazing-the original Reebok step workout available on videotape).
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 8:23 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I did some research yesterday using the health designs website that Deb S. mentioned to further investigate the ingredients of both the UltraClear and UltraClear Plus. They both share some of the same ingredients. The Plus does contain taurine, as an aside. In a profile done of the Typical Amino Acid Profiles, they both contain aspartic acid (all per 2 scoops) 1270mg, cystine 310mg, and glutamic acid 2380mg for the UltraClear Plus and 1340mg of aspartic acid, 330mg cystine, and 2570mg of glutamic acid. YIKES!!!

What has me even more troubled is the explanations and warnings. They BOTH clearly, to me anyways, state that they have not been tested in pregnancy, in breastfeeding women, or in studies with children, and cannot be recommended for that use. If you'll pardon me, WHAT IN THE HECK IS THAT DOCTOR THINKING? I was considering just going to him for the allergy testing and forgetting all the rest of the fecal, urine, and saliva tests for now because if I did have Candida, the antifungal is not to be used while breastfeeding. (The only way I would stop breastfeeding my baby is if I had something so detrimental that I could pass on to her. I don't if Candida fits into that category.) BUT, now I'm not sure that I trust him at all even for the allergy testing.

I did e-mail my question regarding the use of the product during breastfeeding (not even including anything about the glutamate sensivity) just to see what they say. Will keep you posted.

If anyone has any additional thoughts, please, I welcome them. Sincerely, Christine.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 8:54 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I never knew...Last night, I fixed some cubed lamb with dried mint and a little salt sprayed with a little olive oil for grilling on my George Foreman grill. Then, I fixed some quick cook brown rice and steamed peas and carrots. Then I wrapped the combo in a whole wheat tortilla (whole wheat, water, canola oil, and salt). For sauce I mixed a little whole milk yogurt with dried mint, powdered garlic, and salt. And, as I said, UGH!!! It tasted soooo good. But, soon after I ate it, my intestines got upset and I've had a headache on the left side of my head. And, I cannot get rid of the garlic taste. YUCK. (Right away, I tried eating some dried parsley and dried mint to get rid of the taste because I didn't have any fresh. I've even tried Breath Assure which usually used to work for me. In the middle of the night, I tried a little baking soda and water with I don't think helped maybe because I didn't want to chance taking a full dose.)

I'm feeling a little better but not perfect. I'd had two good days in a row. I can't seem to make to a third yet. (Used to be I hardly had one good day, so I guess I am improving.) I don't think I'll ever eat garlic again. I really didn't think that I used that much. My baby even woke up in the middle of the night and had a tough time going back to sleep or staying asleep (after two hours) which generally is unlike her.

I'll make my concoction another time without the garlic.

Anybody else experience this? Think I've read about garlic having sulfur before on this website. Forgive me please if I'm repeating what has already been discussed; but, I figure that repetition and continual confirmation helps keep me going at least. Thanks much, Christine
Deb A.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 11:14 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Christine, you could have reacted to other things, too. You said you used "quick" cook brown rice. To make it cook up quickly, means they had to process it by either treating it with chemicals or cooking it and then dehydrating it. (hydrolysis). This is one possible culprit. You may be allergic to olive oil. Many people are. I have yet to be able to tolerate ANY whole milk yoghurt. What brand was it. Since milk is a protein food, fermenting it with enzymes and bacteria can create free glutamate. Were there any other additives in the yoghurt? The garlic powder may have been treated with something, also. I use and organic granulated garlic. IT's best to use canning salt or sea salt that have no additives. We all have been where you are. 3 steps forward and one back....sometimes 2! Just keep learning and don't look back except to learn from your mistakes. You're doing great.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 11:47 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dear Deb,
I think I left out a couple of things. The quick cook brown rice I used the previous night without reaction. It is the Arrowhead Mills brand, which has ingredients listed: quick cook brown rice. I had assumed there was nothing else. I do only use sea salt without additives. It is Baleine brand iodized sea salt fine crystals. The yogurt is Brown Cow Farm Cream at the Top Plain Whole Milk Yogurt. The garlic powder is The Spice Hunter California Garlic, Granulated. I did just read that 1/8 teaspoon equals an average clove. I'll bet I used more than that. The olive oil I have used many times before. But, I guess any reaction can happen. Maybe the combination of these foods or the amount of garlic created my symptoms. Thanks for the suggestions. Christine
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 12:09 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Garlic powder's processing(drying, toasting etc.) makes it contain free glutamate-I used to use it on everything but now it makes me sick-used to love it on pizza-now I may as well sprinkle msg on it instead-instant reaction-Use the garlic that is packed in pure oil or plain water and salt. Also-Yogurt is tough because they add milk protein(sometimes, I suspect not listed separately-just thrown in as if it is whole milk-with milk solids and caseinate too) and carrageenan-both react like almost pure msg. Christine-you will be fine-keep asking for help and we will always be right here to help.:)
Carol H
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 2:20 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Christine, I'd avoid the yogurt for now. If you are sensitive to tyramine, it's best to avoid fermented foods, that includes yogurt. Also, invest in a garlic crusher. They are so easy to use. Just peel a clove, stick it in the compartment, and squeeze over your food. It's the best tasting way to eat garlic, and you don't have to worry about cutting yourself. Also, I wouldn't avoid eating foods high in vitamin C. Eat a good balanced diet for your baby. Worry first about avoiding MSG, and tyramine, and the good foods will just fall into place in your diet.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 2:46 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

To Adam and Carol H,
Thanks for the suggestions. I actually do have a garlic press that I received as a bridal shower gift two and a half years age. I recently had bought garlic cloves for this purpose but skimped and used the powder. FORGET IT!!! Hee, hee, hee.

As an aside, I made my reservations this morning for Reno for my husband, our daughter, and myself. We all look forward to meeting you and all the others who have been so supportive, informative, and helpful. I've often felt like I've gained a second family vitually overnight and I don't even know any of you personally yet. I've been leary of thrusting myself into any particular group particularly on the internet. I just know in my heart that I am doing the right thing. Talk to you soon, Christine
Deb A.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 3:22 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am wondering if I am hurting myself because I don't use iodized salt. For any salt to contain iodine, I have been told that alginate or cornstarch are often used as carriers for the iodine.
So glad you will be joining us, Christine. I feel the same way you do about this group!
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 3:23 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dear Carol,
I forgot to add that I've eaten that yogurt many times before really without problems. In addition to the upset digestive tract and headache and tasting the garlic long after eating it, I was extremely thirsty. My mouth and throat were sooo dry it was hard to swallow.

I think that eating a balanced diet is one of my biggest fears right now. I've long since cut out eating broccoli, cabbage, beans like kidneys, etc., and other cruciferous veggies to eliminate the potential for my daughter to develop gas from the breastmilk.

I understand that you've started a website (I think it's you) regarding nutrition. I do have several nutrition books, but they don't address our specific needs and combined with a breastfeeding Mom's special needs. I wouldn't construe that as medical advice or should I? I keep trying to rotate foods but I end up eating pretty much the same things. If you or anyone else has any suggestions such as other good, reliable nutrition sites, please let me know. Perhaps they've already been posted here before and I could do a keyword search. Thanks kindly, Christine P.S. I don't mean to make you all do my homework for me, but with a baby saving time is of the essence and helps get to the heart of the matter sooner.
Christine K.P.S.
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2001 - 3:26 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I was wondering whether ther would be a problem with the iodized salt. I thought that as I was typing it. I've heard your question before but cannot remember the answer. Christine
Carol H
Posted on Friday, March 16, 2001 - 2:23 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Christine, yes, that's me. I started a website called It is really in its infancy still. I will really finish it by summer. I've been so busy studying lately, that I haven't gotten as many links in there and backup research references yet. But I promise, they will be there soon. It is a very good suggestion for the site though to include info on breastfeeding and diets that affect the baby. I will make sure I do that.
As for iodine. If you live near the coast, Deb, and you consume ocean fish, you will be getting at least some source of iodine in the diet. For those who live in the middle of the country, and don't eat much fish, it is a good idea to examine iodine intake to make sure you are getting enough.

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