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Battling the MSG Myth » "Help! I Have a Question" » I'm baaacckkk « Previous Next »

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Duchess
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 8:42 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I took a break for a while, working on what I thought was a thyroid issue and possibly may still be....I am still having a horrible time with 'symptoms' but I'm back to the MSG factor. I'm trying really hard now to watch the glutamate loads in foods and rotate my food too due to sensitivities. I can't tell you how many times in the last few days how valueable the information on your website, Debbie A, has reassured me I'm on the right track. My last round was with a supplement the doctor had me on, GRRRRR, it knocked me out for over two hours and left me with a very bizarre, tingly (not good feeling) for about four hours. Okay, rambling here...I'm getting ready to go grocery shopping and wondering if anyone had a convinent list they used for products. I have been looking at some of the lists here and at different websites/blogs. I'm still weeding through issues of gluten sensitivity vs low thyroid vs msg poisoning.

My symptoms specifically are: Can't get words out, paresthesia (tingling) of the legs to the soles of my feet, dry skin up to and including cracked paper-cut type sores because the skin is so dry helped by T3 (see below), back pain, left-sided arm numbness or hand can be helped by adjusting position sometimes, staph outbreak which is not MRSA and not helped by antibiotic so I'm guessing my body is expelling toxins...leaky gut symptoms with a diagnosed food intolerance to potatoes/seafood, and fruit/sugar combo to where I can have one or the other but not together within eight hours of each other. Was taking T3 (Cytomel) which has helped with chronic fibromyalgia type symptoms, started bioidentical for menopause - caused severe water retention yet helped mood and affect. The Christmas lights were brighter this past year. :-) I stopped it though due to the water bloating. I decreased and stopped T3 to see if it was a problem concerned about MSG in the coating type issue thing. Still going through supplements for side effects. Was low in Vit. D supplementing with Pure brand D3, have weeded it out as not being a problem that I can tell but I do have severe digestion/absorption issues.

If anyone has had similar symptoms, I would appreciate what you did that helped. I'm supposed to go Monday to see about getting mercury fillings out and having them replaced with composite fillings. It's kind of the last step. Husband and I thought we were eating good, but I think we might be getting it either through sprays/pesticides or hidden forms which I am trying to really get on the ball about cooking from scratch. I know I'm not saying anything knew when I say it's such a pain...I know all are busy. So that's another thing that would help - real time savers. I have premade the mixes for puddings and biscuits, things like that, but if there are other ideas especially for picky eaters (husband is very picky about side tastes so I usually can't freeze something and bring it out later) I'm also suspect that I am becoming more sensitive to free glutamates as I seem to have reactions to left-overs or starting to have reactions to foods that I used eat without a problem. Thank you for any advice that you might have to offer. I really would just like to heal. I have suffered from back pain, severe muscle/joint inflammation since I was 23 only to have it helped by T3. So was it really a thyroid issue or MSG...??? It kind of makes me angry but what really makes me angry is that we have to constantly be on guard about what we buy or eat, and now they also want to tell us what we can grow or buy...GRRRRRRR!!!!!

Okay, sorry for the long post.
Di
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 9:07 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Duchess, So sorry that you are having such a rough time, gosh all those symptoms. My main symptom was 37 years of low back pain, from a sacroiliac problem exaserbated by free-glutamic acid (and other foods). I know how miserable I was until I got that under control, so I can't imagine how you deal with that plus everything else. I could tell you what I buy at the grocery store, but it probably wouldn't help as it seems you have many more sensitivities than I. All I can suggest is that you try to eat whole organic foods only. I wouldn't bother with biscuits, puddings, etc. unless they are for your husband. I had to (and still do at times) cook separate dishes for my husband. It's not as hard as it used to be because he is accepting my diet more and more as the months go by. I'm lucky that he is understanding of my FGA problem which is helpful. It makes us all angry that we have to constantly be on guard and fight to have our health. It should be a normal, natural thing to eat good healthy food, but sadly it is not...at least not in the US.
Deb A.
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 9:50 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Duchess, do you have my book? If you do, go to the chapter on sulfites. Many of us who are MSG reactive, become allergic to sulfites. MSG compromises many of our systems. Canned or dried or frozen potatoes contain sulfites, along with a lot of seafood (treated on the ship after catching..mostly small shrimp...but other seafood often has it added at the factory as a preservative, along with pyrophosphates...another no-no. Sulfites are in fruit drinks and lots of other foods. Sugar is bleached using sulfites in many cases. That's why molasses contains sulfites, unless it is organic. I buy organic cane sugar, but also use C&H cane sugar, along with pure stevia powder and honey. I, too have a thyroid condition...most likely caused by MSG, since it is an endocrine disruptor. I take Nature-throid. I had to find a pharmacist who would order it after my doctor prescribed it. I get the 195 mcg and cut it in half. It's very inexpensive...natural. Most pills contain hidden sources of free glutamate in the coatings, fillings, and binders..and gelcaps are high in glutamate from the gelatin(hydrolyzed protein).
Duchess
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 12:19 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Deb A.

Thank you all. Yes, I do have your book. It was looking up information about potatoes and sulfites that brought me to your site. ;)

I'll pull it out and get to reading. I'll ask the doctor about Nature-throid. I may be in the process of getting a new doctor. Just depends on how he reacts when I tell him his supplement caused me to pass out for two hours. I'm not relishing that visit. I found the information today on your website about green tea being high in free glutamates. His proprietary blend supplement has 70% green tea extract. Yep, I think I had a MSG reaction.
AdaLovelace
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 1:41 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This may sound crazy but last night I had a dream about a broken light bulb. Breaking a compact fluorescent light bulb in my home last year caused me to educate myself more about mercury. I had no idea that they contained the element. You can read more about it online, but I decided to change all of the lights in my house back to incandescent bulbs.

People can be exposed to mercury by living near a coal power plant, drinking contaminated water, and eating contaminated foods such as fish. I'm abstaining from fish during this time of my detoxification. Then of course there's mercury fillings. I'm so happy to hear that you're getting those removed. I hope you start feeling better instantly after those are out!

Lots of love!
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 2:00 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When it comes to mercury, not all fish are equal. I avoid the bad ones, and enjoy safer ones like anchovies, sardines and salmon.
http://www.fda.gov/food/foodsafety/product-specificinformation/seafood/foodbornepathogenscontaminants/methylmercury/ucm115644.htm
AdaLovelace
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 2:58 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Roy I'm so glad to see salmon on there. That's my favorite!!!
AdaLovelace
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Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2012 - 5:46 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Duchess,
What I should have mentioned before is that the use of saunas is instrumental in detoxifying from heavy metals. I found that I started feeling better instantly after spending some time sweating! If you wouldn't mind disclosing your city, I will try to see if I can find an infrared sauna in your area. If not, any old sauna will do. Infrared saunas are fantastic for removing heavy metals as they penetrate deeper into the skin (like the rays from the sun minus the harmful ones). I hope this helps!

Lots of love.
Deb A.
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Posted on Saturday, February 25, 2012 - 10:55 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry, Duchess, but I didn't know about green tea being high in glutamate. I know it contains caffeine. Where did you see that?
Just as a way of warning, don't be too surprised if your doctor doesn't believe you about glutamate in medications causing us reactions. I'm lucky to have a doctor who did, but many are just plain unaware of all the hidden sources of glutamate and what they are doing to people.
Duchess
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Posted on Sunday, February 26, 2012 - 8:26 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi all. Very busy weekend. I'll try and get links found in the next day or two...I found info. on green tea here on msgmyth. Ada, I'm in Spokane. Good news - after really watching the hidden sources, it appears I might can tolerate some free forms as long as it is not every day. As you all know that makes life a whole lot easier. I'm also trying to cook differently as in at lower heats and not high heats. So just those few changes and I'm already feeling better.
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Monday, February 27, 2012 - 4:40 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Green tea is high not in glutamate, but rather in y-glutamylethylamide, which is neuroprotective.
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0304394000012866
Duchess
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Posted on Monday, February 27, 2012 - 7:37 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, I'm gonna have to dig to find it but in the mean time...I googled green tea high in free glutamates....came across this...I promise as I have time I will try to back track and find the article...


Other common foods high in umami include anchovies, the fish sauce used in Southeast Asian cooking (nam pla in Thai, nuoc mam in Vietnamese) and other fermented fish products, fresh tomatoes, grapefruit (it has more free glutamates than other citrus), soy sauce, dried seaweed, cooked potatoes, green tea, Gruyere cheese and fresh clams.


http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2000/07/05/FD1042CH.DTL&ao=all
Di
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Posted on Monday, February 27, 2012 - 3:25 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Duchess, I'm not sure where the author got his/her information but for the last 5 years that I've been looking at charts of foods high in glutamate I've never seen green tea on a list. That doesn't mean that all the data I've seen is correct either, but I'm very shocked that it had never been included. You learn something new everyday.
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Monday, February 27, 2012 - 11:51 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you scroll down to the diagram in this link you will see how tea is thought to affect neurotransmission.
http://www.springerlink.com/content/l343w817l1042j24/
Roy Piwovar
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Posted on Monday, February 27, 2012 - 11:53 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

...or you could just click here: http://www.springerlink.com/content/l343w817l1042j24//MediaObjects/726_2007_20_Fig5_HTML.gif
LisaS
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Posted on Wednesday, February 29, 2012 - 9:51 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Duchess, the first thing that came to mind with your symptoms was heavy metals and mercury. I have mercury and lead poisoning...and recently found that mercury makes glutamate sensitivity MUCH worse.

I would implore you to be very careful here as I think a lot of treatments can be dangerously aggressive.

If you get your fillings removed (which I highly recommend) check that the person is trained in safe removal. At the very least they need to use a dental dam and separate, high-powered suction to get as many fumes as possible while drilling; ideally they will use external oxygen.

Second, only do a couple at a time, and take lots of milk thistle if you can handle it to support your liver. Even with the above procedures I got ill for a few days every time I got fillings removed if I didn't take the milk thistle.

Before you start doing things like challenge testing, chelation, saunas, etc...read a lot about heavy metals and what works. I would suggest looking at Andy Cutler's work and frequent-low-dose chelation.
LisaS
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Posted on Wednesday, February 29, 2012 - 9:59 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

From wikipedia, green tea has 668 mg / 100 g of free glutamic acid, which is almost as high as soy sauce without any added FGA, *by weight*. However, 100 g of tea is a lot (I'm assuming they measured it dry)! A quick search says use 2-4 grams per cup, so if you are looking at "per serving", green tea is on the same order of magnitude as four ounces of salmon or 1/2 ounce of grape juice...not very significant. And that is assuming all of the FGA came out of the tea as it is brewed, since we don't eat it.
Duchess
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Posted on Thursday, March 01, 2012 - 5:07 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wow, Thank you all. LisaS, the dentist I went is very well trained in the removal and did all the things you listed with dams, suctions, etc. I'll look into the info. you listed.

Well, it's shopping day and I feel nowhere near ready. Hubby is noticing though that the more I make things from scratch and working on the free glutamate issues...the better his life has been. Hopefully soon I can get him to give up his bread and chips which are about the last MSG loaded stuff that I know is around here.
LisaS
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Posted on Friday, March 02, 2012 - 5:50 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've been having great success making our own bread in a bread machine. If you don't have one, there are probably lots at garage sales and craigslist. Otherwise, we find Rudi's Organic breads, spelt and oat, to be very low in FGA, and a nice acceptable and widely available bread.
evelyn
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Posted on Saturday, March 03, 2012 - 4:18 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Lisa - 2-4g per cup is not insignificant in my mind. Where I continually stumbled at the start of my journey (to good health!) was thinking I could tolerate a "little bit" of FGA. Well a little bit here and a little bit there and most sources are not measurable.. My point being that if someone is still experiencing symptoms, they may need to cut out all 'little bits' until they determine what they can and cannot tolerate. For me, total avoidance seems to be the way to go.

I also had issues with heavy metals - had my fillings removed by a Huggins trained dentist (at no higher cost than my regular dentist, mind you!).

Rudi's is good, if you can find it. If you live near a commissary, and have a friend in the military have them see if they can pick some up for you. I found a nice organic bread from bountifulbaskets - a food coop service - if they don't have it in your area, you can start it. Only problem is, in order to get the bread (at 5 loaves for $12!) you have to buy a food basket ($15). I find I that I am able to do better at my local Sprouts (store) buying what I want on sale, rather than what bountiful baskets is offering. I still have an overabundance of oranges in my fridge as the two orders I did with bountiful baskets contained an overabundance of oranges :-) I plan to ask a friend who gets it to add bread to her order, since you can get 2 orders of bread with one basket. (but you can't get one order of bread with no basket)

For anyone in Arizona - the3000club.org offers 60lbs of produce for $10, weekly at different locations. I pick up two orders (you have to go to two different sites to do that) and distribute it to struggling families in my church. This is produce that the markets passed on because it was too ripe to give them enough time to transport and sell it. It is brought up from packing plants in Mexico and often includes organic vegetables. Why it can't be distributed in Mexico where the need is much greater is (so far) a mystery to me, but I plan to see if I can find out...
LisaS
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Posted on Monday, March 05, 2012 - 9:09 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry, I was confusing. That is 2-4g of tea leaves per cup. Yes, 2-4g of glutamate would be a lot! But 2-4g of tea, at 668mg/100g, ends up being about 20 mg of free glutamate per 2-4g tea, the amount you would use for a cup of tea, and who knows how much of that comes out in the tea itself. Even if you suppose all of it does, 25 mg / cup would be...(googles and gets out calculator) about 11mg per 100g, which is half as much as human milk and eggs, and a quarter as much as chicken. Of course you would drink more tea volume than you would eat of that chicken, but still it's on the same order of magnitude.

My point was that, from the data I can find, green tea is less offensive than most whole foods.

On the other hand, green, as well as black, tea is notoriously high in flouride even if organic. Ugh. So there is still reason to avoid it.
cathy218
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Posted on Saturday, May 26, 2012 - 6:38 pm:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctor and Dentist close to Walla Walla. Looking for dentist well versed in removing amalgm fillings and a well versed in MSG sensitivities doctor close to Walla Walla, WA??
sara
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Posted on Sunday, May 27, 2012 - 8:54 am:   Delete PostPrint Post   Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

http://iaomt.org seems to have an extensive list of amalgam free dentists - I know nothing about any of these - perhaps Deb A. might have a idea who as she is in Eastern WA

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